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Thread: A Look Back at the M14 Rifle

  1. #1
    Command Sgt Major budster's Avatar
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    Owner / Administrator Hawk's Avatar
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    Re: A Look Back at the M14 Rifle

    There's something different in the second pic......can you find it?
    Semper-Fi! Hawk
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    Sgt Major VanHahner's Avatar
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    Re: A Look Back at the M14 Rifle

    I liked all the comments !
    The article is just rhetoric that you have heard a thousand times before !

    Hawk: You talking about the T44
    U.S.M.C. Scout Sniper 67-68

  5. #4
    Owner / Administrator Hawk's Avatar
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    Re: A Look Back at the M14 Rifle

    Yep!
    I don't believe it was Macnamara who ordered the destruction.
    Semper-Fi! Hawk
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  6. #5
    Sgt Major VanHahner's Avatar
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    Re: A Look Back at the M14 Rifle

    Total M14 production was 1,380,358 rifles. Of these, 450,000 were transferred to foreign countries, but some 750,000 were destroyed during the Clinton administration. As of 2004, only 170,000 M14s remained in storage.
    https://www.ammoland.com/2012/06/the...#axzz5q0Jm3Ghq



    "After numerous delays and production crises – including the rejection in December of 1960 of 1,784 of H&R receivers (about ten percent of the receivers that had been made up to that time) that could not withstand the pressure of firing due to a steel mix-up – Robert McNamara made a famous speech on the rifle program in June of 1961, stating: “I think it is a disgrace the way the project was handled. I don’t mean particularly by the Army, but I mean by the nation. This is a relatively simple job, building a rifle, compared to building a satellite or a lunar lander or a missile system.” At that time, there existed a grand total of only 133,386 M14 rifles, despite the type having been adopted four years prior."

    To top it off, there was a picture taking at 'Checkpoint Charlie' (Berlin Wall) in 1961 of U.S. soldiers still carrying M1's, because of the numerous delays in M14 production.

    McNamara had had enough !

    The Berlin Crisis of 1961 and the initial absence of the M14 rifle would herald the end of the M14 program. Two years later, Robert McNamara would enact the immediate cessation of M14 rifle production, the temporary procurement of the M16 rifle, and the SPIW program, which was to take three years. Despite McNamara’s opinion that the M16 was an off-the-shelf and temporary solution to the US rifle procurement problem, it proved to be neither. The troubles experienced by the M16 rifles and their users in Vietnam, which were caused by poor ammunition specifications, tainted powder, a lack of chrome-lining of the barrel to resist tropical conditions, and the lack of weapon-specific training and cleaning kits, have since come to overshadow those problems that dogged the M14 rifle program. Paradoxically, the M16 family of weapons proved to be far from a temporary fixture of US Army procurement, and new M4A1 Carbines – the M16’s short-barreled, modular descendant – continue to be procured for the US Armed Forces.

    https://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/...nd-of-the-m14/
    U.S.M.C. Scout Sniper 67-68

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  8. #6
    Squad Leader Old Sarge's Avatar
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    Re: A Look Back at the M14 Rifle

    Part of the long procurement delay was a decision to not have Springfield Armory be a major supplier, but rather more of a technical support role for commercial firms being brought on line to produce the M14. And it seems Murphy struck pretty hard, as whatever could go wrong, did go wrong, to delay commercial production of the M14. Steel shortages, labor strikes, etc. Things well beyond the control of the Ordnance Dept. and commercial makers of the M14.

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    Machine Gunner NMC_EXP's Avatar
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    Re: A Look Back at the M14 Rifle

    First I'd heard of the M14 quality problems.

    My career was with Caterpillar. Worked in R&D, engineering and manufacturing and I absolutely agree that Murphy's Law will take over.....if a manufacturer allows it to. Then there are things a company cannot control like labor trouble and raw material shortages.

    The foundation is a good design plus a material specification that is correct for the application.

    After that it is simply a matter of making a finished part that meets the dimensions on the print and the specifications for the material.

    There may be hundreds of steps involved in turning raw steel barstock into a rifle receiver but the manufacturing operations involved in each step are understood and there should be quality control checkpoints built into each step of the process. J.C. Garand did not just hand over a blueprint for the M1, he provided the complete manufacturing process.

    Maybe it was the "low cost bidder" thing at work. The accountants hate "fixed cost/overhead" expenses and the Quality Control Dept is one of the biggest sources of it and the first to get the axe. I saw this happen first hand.

    De-emphasizing or eliminating Quality Control is not Murphy at work - it is a self inflicted wound.
    “After all is said and done, successful rifle shooting on the range is nothing more than first finding a rifle and lot of ammunition which will do precisely the same thing shot after shot, and then developing the same skill in the rifleman.” ~ Capt. E. C. Crossman (The Book of the Springfield)

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    Sgt Major VanHahner's Avatar
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    Re: A Look Back at the M14 Rifle

    Quote Originally Posted by Hawk View Post
    There's something different in the second pic......can you find it?
    btw: What was it ?
    U.S.M.C. Scout Sniper 67-68

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    Owner / Administrator Hawk's Avatar
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    Re: A Look Back at the M14 Rifle

    The magazine is not latched.
    Semper-Fi! Hawk
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    Re: A Look Back at the M14 Rifle

    The T44E4 is missing the ability to mount a scope mount and does not have the wood stock relief cut for operating the bolt stop.
    Last edited by Different; 6th July 2019 at 07:01 PM.

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